• > UPDATE < Thanks to all who've so far DONATED helping us update MobiTog, keep 'em coming please! AND A BIG THANK YOU ALL for your continued generosity & support!
  • IMPORTANT - PLEASE READ THIS THREAD < Tap for linky - MobiTog is open for business with some minor stuff on-going... :)

Wakeup call for privacy

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
I want to share a link. It's from Halide app web page. It is an interesting article about privacy.
https://blog.halide.cam/a-picture-is-worth-a-thousand-cookies-8400efa3d650
Yikes! It’s worse than I thought. I already had taken a number of the steps mentioned in the article when I first set up my iPhone but I think I’ll be more careful with my location data in photos when I post. It is useful to me for my own use but I guess it’s better not to share it. I never use “log in with Facebook” or similar things. I never signed up for Instagram, Twitter, and a bunch of others but I am occasionally on FB.
I think it’s great that an app developer is taking such a stand.
I’m mostly using DuckDuckGo for my browser and search engine on other browsers and use VPN in some situations. Trying to avoid ad tracking as much as possible. However, I notice if I go looking for something on Amazon but don’t buy it I soon get an email asking if I’m still looking for something from their book department, or whatever. I find it creepy when Game Centre gives me a pop up saying welcome back Brian.
 

JillyG

MobiLifer
Mobi Veteran
Real Name
Jilly
Device
iPhone Xs Max
My 365
My MobiTog 365

rizole

In for it!
MobiSupporter
Device
Samsung
This is one of the reasons I prefer android over ios. There are alternatives to Google but (correct me if I'm wrong) there's no alternative to iTunes and apples ecosystem.

My basic privacy steps on my phone are:
Don't install apps where there is a web interface. So Facebook, youtube, Google Play and Twitter are not on my phone and have no permissions.
Where I have a real distrust of a platform it gets sandboxed in it's own browser which is only used for that platform so that it can't track my browsing. Eg. Facebook.
Find alternatives for distrusted platforms. I use apkpure instead of Google play.
Use an adblock and tracking blocker in your browser. I use ublock origin and privacy badger.
Use an alternative search. As Brian mentioned above, duckduckgo is good and respects your privacy.
Turn off location services.
Turn off any and all Google services you can find.
Protonmail.com is an encrypted email provider that respects your privacy.
Don't use the cloud as a storage solution. Handle your own storage locally and use the cloud as a redundant backup. If you're really paranoid, don't use cloud services.

This is just me of course, your mileage might vary. I used to come across as a bit of a paranoid nut in years gone by but Im looking less paranoid with each revealed privacy violation.

Okay.... maybe a little paranoid...o_O
 

MsDee

MobiLifer
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Dee
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
I closed my Facebook account over a year ago... Put in my delete request a week ago. It's worse than you probably think. I am going to stop adding to Instagram as well. Facebook owns Instagram.

I download my data first. ;)
 

sinnerjohn

Smooth Bug Catcher
Real Name
John
Device
Pixel
I'm probably most at odds with people on here, as I think its mindless paranoia and Instagram bashing. Instagram may be owned by Facebook but its a photo sharing site, that's its purpose.
The first line on there is 'Go to system settings, tap on Instagram, and disable access to Photos' WHAT !!
Why not just delete all the apps on your phone and better still power off the phone and put it in a lead lined draw ;)
Lets disable photo access on MobiTog too and look at blank space.
Do I care if someone sees a photo of what I had for my dinner last night, nope. Do I really care if Facebook knows I rang my wife to tell her I love her, nope.
If you don't agree with what Facebook has done just delete it and have done with it.
I know an IT guy at work that actually re-installs Windows every time he uses on-line banking, now THAT is paranoia :rolleyes:
 

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
This is one of the reasons I prefer android over ios. There are alternatives to Google but (correct me if I'm wrong) there's no alternative to iTunes and apples ecosystem.

My basic privacy steps on my phone are:
Don't install apps where there is a web interface. So Facebook, youtube, Google Play and Twitter are not on my phone and have no permissions.
Where I have a real distrust of a platform it gets sandboxed in it's own browser which is only used for that platform so that it can't track my browsing. Eg. Facebook.
Find alternatives for distrusted platforms. I use apkpure instead of Google play.
Use an adblock and tracking blocker in your browser. I use ublock origin and privacy badger.
Use an alternative search. As Brian mentioned above, duckduckgo is good and respects your privacy.
Turn off location services.
Turn off any and all Google services you can find.
Protonmail.com is an encrypted email provider that respects your privacy.
Don't use the cloud as a storage solution. Handle your own storage locally and use the cloud as a redundant backup. If you're really paranoid, don't use cloud services.

This is just me of course, your mileage might vary. I used to come across as a bit of a paranoid nut in years gone by but Im looking less paranoid with each revealed privacy violation.

Okay.... maybe a little paranoid...o_O
As they say, just because you think you might be paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t really out to get you.
 

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
I'm probably most at odds with people on here, as I think its mindless paranoia and Instagram bashing. Instagram may be owned by Facebook but its a photo sharing site, that's its purpose.
The first line on there is 'Go to system settings, tap on Instagram, and disable access to Photos' WHAT !!
Why not just delete all the apps on your phone and better still power off the phone and put it in a lead lined draw ;)
Lets disable photo access on MobiTog too and look at blank space.
Do I care if someone sees a photo of what I had for my dinner last night, nope. Do I really care if Facebook knows I rang my wife to tell her I love her, nope.
If you don't agree with what Facebook has done just delete it and have done with it.
I know an IT guy at work that actually re-installs Windows every time he uses on-line banking, now THAT is paranoia :rolleyes:
I think what we’re wondering is where is this all leading to. Do we have any rights to privacy left?
There can be a big difference between the originally stated purpose of a site and what they eventually realize they can do with all the collected bits of personal data users provide. In the end it all comes down to profits. If using your personal data can increase their profits you san be sure they will find a way to do so.
The internet now functions entirely by advertising. Content provided free but with advertising. A huge amount of effort is made to draw your attention away from the content to the ads. It’s all about getting you to click that link. To further the efficiency of the ads we have ads targeted to your likes. A whole lot of tracking goes on in the background trying to determine your likes and dislikes, how old you are, where you live, and everything else, all for the purpose of delivering targeted ads to you. As long as that remains the main purpose it is just somewhat of a nuisance.
The technology is there for it to become something more insidious. That is where we must be on guard.
To some degree the internet now depends entirely on ads to pay the bills and if we do a good enough job blocking the ads will that cause a user-pay system to be born? No more free internet? Already in the US there have been attempts to make users pay for different levels of access.
We use it as a free access to information service. Who controls the content? Who controls truth.
 
Last edited:

sinnerjohn

Smooth Bug Catcher
Real Name
John
Device
Pixel
I think what we’re wondering is where is this all leading to. Do we have any rights to privacy left?
There can be a big difference between the originally stated purpose of a site and what they eventually realize they can do with all the collected bits of personal data users provide. In the end it all comes down to profits. If using your personal data can increase their profits you san be sure they will find a way to do so.
The internet now functions entirely by advertising. Content provided free but with advertising. A huge amount of effort is made to draw your attention away from the content to the ads. It’s all about getting you to click that link. To further the efficiency of the ads we have ads targeted to your likes. A whole lot of tracking goes on in the background trying to determine your likes and dislikes, how old you are, where you live, and everything else, all for the purpose of delivering targeted ads to you. As long as that remains the main purpose it is just somewhat of a nuisance.
The technology is there for it to become something more insidious. That is where we must be on guard.
To some degree the internet now depends entirely on ads to pay the bills and if we do a good enough job blocking the ads will that cause a user-pay system to be born? No more free internet? Already in the US there have been attempts to make users pay for different levels of access.
We use it as a free access to information service. Who controls the content? Who controls truth.
As long as we understand that nothing is ever really free, i.e. a website or an app, then its just a matter of honesty on the part of said app or website. I'm surprised that people were shocked about the use of personal data on Facebook, there always has to be a trade off.
Maybe there is also benefit from more personalised advertising?
 

JillyG

MobiLifer
Mobi Veteran
Real Name
Jilly
Device
iPhone Xs Max
My 365
My MobiTog 365
I'm probably most at odds with people on here, as I think its mindless paranoia and Instagram bashing. Instagram may be owned by Facebook but its a photo sharing site, that's its purpose.
The first line on there is 'Go to system settings, tap on Instagram, and disable access to Photos' WHAT !!
Why not just delete all the apps on your phone and better still power off the phone and put it in a lead lined draw ;)
Lets disable photo access on MobiTog too and look at blank space.
Do I care if someone sees a photo of what I had for my dinner last night, nope. Do I really care if Facebook knows I rang my wife to tell her I love her, nope.
If you don't agree with what Facebook has done just delete it and have done with it.
I know an IT guy at work that actually re-installs Windows every time he uses on-line banking, now THAT is paranoia :rolleyes:
Did you ring your wife to tell her you love her? That’s so sweet. I love you even more now.:rolleyes:
 

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
As long as we understand that nothing is ever really free, i.e. a website or an app, then its just a matter of honesty on the part of said app or website. I'm surprised that people were shocked about the use of personal data on Facebook, there always has to be a trade off.
Maybe there is also benefit from more personalised advertising?
The way ad tracking works I always get ads for thing I already bought. They are never helpful.
 

Lzed

MobiStaff
Site Staff
Real Name
Larry Zasitko
Device
iPad (Generic)
The way ad tracking works I always get ads for thing I already bought. They are never helpful.
On the other hand Karen and I have been looking at some of the smart locks. I can go up and down the stairs but even now it takes longer then it did even a year ago and Karen can’t at all so we thought about the smart locks and have looked on some sites. now we get ads from Amazon who want to sell them to us or Facebook where they have links to sites like Amazon with them. Ads showed on both Amazon and Facebook before we actually even looked at Amazon so its not only Amazon that tracks what you are looking at.
Facebook has always had problems with privacy so this latest is not a surprise at all and it will happen again and again in the future. People are all too willing to give up information and others are always going to try to capitalize on it...
 

terse

MobiLifer
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Ted
Device
iPhone Xs
I'm surprised that people were shocked about the use of personal data on Facebook, there always has to be a trade off.
I think it's impossible to give informed consent to such collection because so few people have any idea of the extent of it or of what the data can be used for. I usually keep an eye on these things, but I was taken aback to find out that Facebook is collecting data from any app that uses the Facebook SDK (to offer an option to post images to Facebook, for example), whether or not you're logged into Facebook or even have a Facebook account (I don't). Deleting your Facebook account doesn't stop it.

It's not simply that the information collected reveals anything sensitive about you personally (it might or might not), but also that the mass aggregate of the data collected is mined and massaged to make decisions and take actions that may affect you personally (possibly benignly or, as in the current case of Cambridge Analytica, not).
 

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
I think it's impossible to give informed consent to such collection because so few people have any idea of the extent of it or of what the data can be used for. I usually keep an eye on these things, but I was taken aback to find out that Facebook is collecting data from any app that uses the Facebook SDK (to offer an option to post images to Facebook, for example), whether or not you're logged into Facebook or even have a Facebook account (I don't). Deleting your Facebook account doesn't stop it.

It's not simply that the information collected reveals anything sensitive about you personally (it might or might not), but also that the mass aggregate of the data collected is mined and massaged to make decisions and take actions that may affect you personally (possibly benignly or, as in the current case of Cambridge Analytica, not).
That’s exactly the problem. Little tidbits of info seem innocuous on their own, but when accumulated over many images, or texts, starts to provide meaningful data.
Now, imagine the number of people who express political opinions on social media, and imagine who might be interested in that information.
There’s a very real chilling effect happening when free speech can and will be collected and counted against you.
 

FundyBrian

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Brian Townsend
Device
iPhone 8 Plus
My 365
My MobiTog 365
Think about every time you tapped “like” on other people’s messages. Could be an opinion was expressed, or a seemingly harmless meme text that resonated with you. Even though you didn’t express the opinion yourself you supported that opinion or position. Just examining the accumulated total of the things you expressed like or support for adds up to quite a significant profile of your opinions.
 

RoseCat

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Catherine
Device
iPhone 7 Plus
Interestingly, I am of @sinnerjohn’s mindset. I do follow some privacy steps, but I’m nowhere near where rizole falls on the spectrum. Although I won’t add just anyone and everyone as a friend/follower, I don’t really care about all the other in-depth stuff that’s being discussed. Just don’t have the time or patience to deal with or think about it, first, and I’m not doing anything illegal so..... <shrugs>
 

RoseCat

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Catherine
Device
iPhone 7 Plus
As long as we understand that nothing is ever really free, i.e. a website or an app, then its just a matter of honesty on the part of said app or website. I'm surprised that people were shocked about the use of personal data on Facebook, there always has to be a trade off.
:thumbs:
 

RoseCat

MobiStaff
Site Staff
MobiSupporter
Real Name
Catherine
Device
iPhone 7 Plus
I think it's impossible to give informed consent to such collection because so few people have any idea of the extent of it or of what the data can be used for. I usually keep an eye on these things, but I was taken aback to find out that Facebook is collecting data from any app that uses the Facebook SDK (to offer an option to post images to Facebook, for example), whether or not you're logged into Facebook or even have a Facebook account (I don't). Deleting your Facebook account doesn't stop it.

It's not simply that the information collected reveals anything sensitive about you personally (it might or might not), but also that the mass aggregate of the data collected is mined and massaged to make decisions and take actions that may affect you personally (possibly benignly or, as in the current case of Cambridge Analytica, not).
That’s exactly the problem. Little tidbits of info seem innocuous on their own, but when accumulated over many images, or texts, starts to provide meaningful data.
Now, imagine the number of people who express political opinions on social media, and imagine who might be interested in that information.
There’s a very real chilling effect happening when free speech can and will be collected and counted against you.
I suppose if one is easily swayed by advertising, or political propaganda, etc. it could be detrimental. I think that’s why I’m not that concerned. Those things don’t shape how I buy/consume/vote, etc.
 

sinnerjohn

Smooth Bug Catcher
Real Name
John
Device
Pixel
Interestingly, I am of @sinnerjohn’s mindset. I do follow some privacy steps, but I’m nowhere near where rizole falls on the spectrum. Although I won’t add just anyone and everyone as a friend/follower, I don’t really care about all the other in-depth stuff that’s being discussed. Just don’t have the time or patience to deal with or think about it, first, and I’m not doing anything illegal so..... <shrugs>
Ahhhh noooo people don't usually agree with me :lmao:
 
Top